Breeding and Genetics

[jody1988]

Hello everyone I am new here I was wondering if anyone can tell me if one parent needs to be red to produce red pups or if it can be carried?
Thanks,
Jody

 

[schierling]

I believe it can be carried, but I am not sure. I was told that my little miniature dachshund who is almost the size of a standard (love him anyway) could easily have had two mini parents. I saw his mother and she was tiny, did not see Dad. Anyway the vet says that since these dogs are bred for various traits it is not unusual to see traits come from a couple of previous generations and show up in one pup. So my boy got a little bigger, but he is still one of the best parts of my day!

 

[Steph]

Red cannot be carried as it is the dominant gene. It can however be masked by other genes.

This is a great site for getting genetic info, the other would be to pick up Dachshund Coats, Colors and Patterns by Lisa J Emerson of Eridox Dachshunds.

http://www.lildachs.com/genetics.htm

 

[DeafDogs]

Steph's right. Red is a dominant colour, so cannot be carried. One parent must be red, genetically, in order for the pups to be red. Black and tan, dilution and most other colours can show up in 2 red parents though.

 

[jody1988]

Thanks everyone I have been told that red can be carried and then that one parent has to be red to get red puppies... SO i had got 100 different answers so wanted to ask more peoples opinions
Thnaks
Jody

 

[MarciaA]

Color-Pattern genetic basics

Hope this helps in understanding the basics

The colors:

Red (black nosed) is dominant. Chocolate, black, dilute, and cream are all recessive, therefore can be carried. You cannot get a
dominant red from 2 blacks, chocolates, dilutes, or creams being bred together. Dominant red cannot be carried it must be red
to produce red, much like dapple, brindle, and wire.

2 black and tans can produce chocolates, dilutes, and pointed creams.
However, 2 chocolates could only produce chocolates, Isabella's, e-reds (whole 'nother ball of wax :lol, and chocolate
creams and on the rare occasion Isabella creams.


The Coats:

Longhairs can't carry smooth or wire.

Smooths can carry longhair, but cannot carry wire.

Wire can carry smooth and longhair.

Genetics is a struggle and partly because the way we use the language.
For each trait, a dog has a pair of genes, one donated by each parent.
A dominant trait is manifested if present in only one of the genes.
A recessive trait is manifested only if present in each gene of the pair.
For Coat type the Hierarchy goes like this:
(W)ire Absolutely Dominant
(S)mooth Dominant only to Long
(L)ong Recessive to Wire or Smooth

Dogs with a twin pair ( W/W, S/S, L/L ) can only offer their own coat type to any progeny.
Since (W) is absolutely dominant, a W/W dog will only produce wires irrespective of what their mate offers.
Canada, the UK and other kennel clubs dis-allow cross-breeding of Coat types.

Two W/S dogs could produce smooth puppies. Smooth is recessive only in the presence of the Wire gene.

A W/S dog and a W/L dog could produce a S/L pair of genes, in other words, a Smooth puppy.

Two W/L dogs could likewise produce longhair pups.

Wire breeders (show) have a difficult time setting a uniform and correct coat because of the issues of incomplete dominance and the
recessive nature of the other coat types.


The Patterns:

Piebald can be carried, but one parent must be brindled or dappled to have dapple or brindled puppies.

When a double dapple is bred to a solid all the pups will be dappled.

If you breed 2 piebalds together you will get all piebalds, but that is not the case with brindles and dapples.

Recessive is a gene that is only inherited from both parents. Recessive genes can be carried.

Dominant is a gene that is inherited from only one parent. Dominant genes cannot be carried.

 

[MarciaA]

more info

You Can Find Them in These Colors:
Red ~ Black ~ Chocolate ~ Cream ~ Isabella ~ Blue
with or without tan points


Red
From a very pale strawberry blond, to a deep mahogany red, with or without black shading.

Black & Tan, Black & Cream,
and Solid black


Chocolate & Tan, Chocolate & Cream,
and Solid Chocolate
(brindle doesn't show well in Chocolates)
This is a recessive color, it must be showing or carried in both parents to be produced (black/tan that carries chocolate, bred to a
chocolate or another blk/tan that carries chocolate could have cho/tan and/or blk/tan pups)
But breeds dominant to 2 chocolate & tans (you would get all cho/tan pups). Chlt can't carry black and tan, but blk/tan can carry
chocolate

Cream, called Wheaten in wires.
With or without black shading.
(This is a Dilute color of Red)

Isabella (also called Fawn) & Tan, Isabella & Cream
solid Isabella.
(this is a Dilute color of Chocolate)
This is a recessive color, it must be showing or carried in both parents to be produced.

Blue & Tan and Blue & Cream
and Solid Blue
(This is a Dilute color of Black and Tan)
This is a recessive color, it must be showing or carried in both parents to be produced.

In any of these Patterns:
Dapple ~ Brindle ~ Piebald ~ Sable(smooth & longcoat)/Wildboar(wirehair)


Dapple
One parent MUST be dapple to have dapple pups, as it is a dominate gene.
A dapple dog (called Merle in other breeds like a collie) is spotted and mottled in appearance. For instance, a black and tan dapple will have area's of silver hair, this is due to the dapple gene diluting the black color ~stripping it of it's pigment as a way of describing it. This dappling effect can be in any of the color, the tan points, over all the body, in the eyes creating blue eyes or blue spots in the eye. This is a basic description. When you see the reference of Reverse dapple, it is used to describe that there is a heavier pattern of the lighter dappling on a dogs body than the darker self, say black to stick with our earlier example, and would appear more silver all over rather the splotches of silver interspersed in the black. It doesn't mean it is a different pattern of dapple. There can be other patterns mixed in there also, you can have a dog who is dapple/brindle/piebald. You cannot register a dog with multiple patterns with AKC, but that doesn't mean they aren't out there. They can be very lovely interesting dogs, and would still be good pets, but would be unable to be shown in a ring, and are not recognized by any dachshund organizations.
Dapple cannot be carried, but it can be hidden. You may have a dog that appears solid that had a small dapple spot at birth and is unseen later on. This is how many double dapples are produced unknowingly by breeders. Not all pups in a litter will be dapple, but can be (though the odds are against it). Only one parent has to carry the gene. But if you were to take a solid puppy from a dapple breeding that puppy would never produce a dapple, unless it was bred to another dapple.

Double Dapple
Breeding 2 dapple dogs together will produce double dapples. This can be a lethal combination, the double gene can land in
the eyes causing blindness, in the ear causing deafness, some pups can be born without eyes or other malformations. Some are born perfectly healthy and beautiful. Double dapples' may have blue eyes, partially blue eyes, or a blue eye and a brown eye, and are called "Wall" coloring. They may have white blazes on their heads, white tail tips, and extensive white on their feet,
bellies, and sides. DORG has a nice bit of information about it. A double dapple bred to a solid dog, will have all dapple pups
(not double dapple pups). This pattern is not acceptable for show. See below in the piebald paragraph for The Dachshund
Color Crisis.

Piebald
The Piebald gene is recessive, and can be carried for generations. Piebalds look very similar to a beagle, with
the large spots of color on a white background and may have ticking (smalls spots from just a few to thickly scattered all over).
Not all piebalds have ticking. It can be carried, but to produce a true piebald and not a dog that *carries for piebald* both
parents must be piebalds, or at least both carry it. They can be all white with just a small patch of color on the head or
elsewhere on the body, or have a *tuxedo* effect of a large white area on the chest also. All piebalds will have a white tipped
tail, and toes, and should not have blue eyes.
They can have blue eyes if they are dapple/pie. All the patterns can be found on a piebald, although it too cannot be registered
with all the patterns. At this time, the DCA (Dachshund Club of America) no longer allows piebalds in the show ring. AKC
follows the rules set by the DCA. Many piebald fanciers are very unhappy with this decision, and are attempting to have them re-instated. I wish them the best of luck in this endeavor, as piebalds are just as beautiful as any other color and pattern.

Brindle
The brindle pattern is a dominate gene, one parent has to carry the gene to produce brindle pups. The brindle appears as stripes like seen on a tiger or zebra, and can be seen scattered all over the body. In a dark color like
chocolate or black, the pattern might only be seen in the tan points as the darker color will hide it.

Sable ~ Long coats
Wild Boar ~ Smooth and Wire coats
Sable is a dominate gene, one parent must be sable to produce sable pups.
Sable/Wildboars appear to look like a black and tan at first glance. All body hairs, except on the face and feet, are banded with two colors, the self color occurs closest to the dog's body while the darker color occurs near the hair tip. The face and feet are usually just the dog's self color. The most common (and sables are not that common) are red sables, the undercoat is red with black tipped hair so they appear as a black and tan. I have heard they can come in any color since it is a pattern.

 

[JJNNdox]

more info

You Can Find Them in These Colors:
Red ~ Black ~ Chocolate ~ Cream ~ Isabella ~ Blue
with or without tan points


Red
From a very pale strawberry blond, to a deep mahogany red, with or without black shading.

Black & Tan, Black & Cream,
and Solid black


Chocolate & Tan, Chocolate & Cream,
and Solid Chocolate
(brindle doesn't show well in Chocolates)
This is a recessive color, it must be showing or carried in both parents to be produced (black/tan that carries chocolate, bred to a
chocolate or another blk/tan that carries chocolate could have cho/tan and/or blk/tan pups)
But breeds dominant to 2 chocolate & tans (you would get all cho/tan pups). Chlt can't carry black and tan, but blk/tan can carry
chocolate

Cream, called Wheaten in wires.
With or without black shading.
(This is a Dilute color of Red)

Isabella (also called Fawn) & Tan, Isabella & Cream
solid Isabella.
(this is a Dilute color of Chocolate)
This is a recessive color, it must be showing or carried in both parents to be produced.

Blue & Tan and Blue & Cream
and Solid Blue
(This is a Dilute color of Black and Tan)
This is a recessive color, it must be showing or carried in both parents to be produced.

In any of these Patterns:
Dapple ~ Brindle ~ Piebald ~ Sable(smooth & longcoat)/Wildboar(wirehair)


Dapple
One parent MUST be dapple to have dapple pups, as it is a dominate gene.
A dapple dog (called Merle in other breeds like a collie) is spotted and mottled in appearance. For instance, a black and tan dapple will have area's of silver hair, this is due to the dapple gene diluting the black color ~stripping it of it's pigment as a way of describing it. This dappling effect can be in any of the color, the tan points, over all the body, in the eyes creating blue eyes or blue spots in the eye. This is a basic description. When you see the reference of Reverse dapple, it is used to describe that there is a heavier pattern of the lighter dappling on a dogs body than the darker self, say black to stick with our earlier example, and would appear more silver all over rather the splotches of silver interspersed in the black. It doesn't mean it is a different pattern of dapple. There can be other patterns mixed in there also, you can have a dog who is dapple/brindle/piebald. You cannot register a dog with multiple patterns with AKC, but that doesn't mean they aren't out there. They can be very lovely interesting dogs, and would still be good pets, but would be unable to be shown in a ring, and are not recognized by any dachshund organizations.
Dapple cannot be carried, but it can be hidden. You may have a dog that appears solid that had a small dapple spot at birth and is unseen later on. This is how many double dapples are produced unknowingly by breeders. Not all pups in a litter will be dapple, but can be (though the odds are against it). Only one parent has to carry the gene. But if you were to take a solid puppy from a dapple breeding that puppy would never produce a dapple, unless it was bred to another dapple.

Double Dapple
Breeding 2 dapple dogs together will produce double dapples. This can be a lethal combination, the double gene can land in
the eyes causing blindness, in the ear causing deafness, some pups can be born without eyes or other malformations. Some are born perfectly healthy and beautiful. Double dapples' may have blue eyes, partially blue eyes, or a blue eye and a brown eye, and are called "Wall" coloring. They may have white blazes on their heads, white tail tips, and extensive white on their feet,
bellies, and sides. DORG has a nice bit of information about it. A double dapple bred to a solid dog, will have all dapple pups
(not double dapple pups). This pattern is not acceptable for show. See below in the piebald paragraph for The Dachshund
Color Crisis.

Piebald
The Piebald gene is recessive, and can be carried for generations. Piebalds look very similar to a beagle, with
the large spots of color on a white background and may have ticking (smalls spots from just a few to thickly scattered all over).
Not all piebalds have ticking. It can be carried, but to produce a true piebald and not a dog that *carries for piebald* both
parents must be piebalds, or at least both carry it. They can be all white with just a small patch of color on the head or
elsewhere on the body, or have a *tuxedo* effect of a large white area on the chest also. All piebalds will have a white tipped
tail, and toes, and should not have blue eyes.
They can have blue eyes if they are dapple/pie. All the patterns can be found on a piebald, although it too cannot be registered
with all the patterns. At this time, the DCA (Dachshund Club of America) no longer allows piebalds in the show ring. AKC
follows the rules set by the DCA. Many piebald fanciers are very unhappy with this decision, and are attempting to have them re-instated. I wish them the best of luck in this endeavor, as piebalds are just as beautiful as any other color and pattern.

Brindle
The brindle pattern is a dominate gene, one parent has to carry the gene to produce brindle pups. The brindle appears as stripes like seen on a tiger or zebra, and can be seen scattered all over the body. In a dark color like
chocolate or black, the pattern might only be seen in the tan points as the darker color will hide it.

Sable ~ Long coats
Wild Boar ~ Smooth and Wire coats
Sable is a dominate gene, one parent must be sable to produce sable pups.
Sable/Wildboars appear to look like a black and tan at first glance. All body hairs, except on the face and feet, are banded with two colors, the self color occurs closest to the dog's body while the darker color occurs near the hair tip. The face and feet are usually just the dog's self color. The most common (and sables are not that common) are red sables, the undercoat is red with black tipped hair so they appear as a black and tan. I have heard they can come in any color since it is a pattern.

What colors can you breed to a black and tan dapple?